* An abridged version of this article originally appeared in the Podcast Movement 2018 official program. If you were there and we didn’t get a chance to meet in Philly, shoot me an email and say hi! Or better yet, join us in The Cut The Bullshit Podcasting Community! Ok, on to the article *
One of the most common pieces of advice I hear given to new podcasters goes a little something like this:
“Just create the content you want to create and chances are there are gazillions* of other people out there interested in it as well!”
* Ok, so no one says “gazillions” probably, but it’s called dramatic effect yo…
On the surface, there’s some good advice in here. By creating content that you’re both interested in and passionate about, you’re (hopefully) ensuring that you don’t give up on the show due to lack of either content or interest on your part.
This is all well and good for podcasters who simply want to talk about something they care about, connect with others who feel similarly, and have a good time doing so. A large number of podcasters, however, have more ambitious goals.
Having made the time and financial commitment to be here at Podcast Movement, I’m guessing you may be one of these podcasters.
Beyond the sheer joy of podcasting, you may be looking to establish yourself as an influencer or thought-leader in your space, sell your show to sponsors, sell your own products or services through your show, or join a big-time podcast network who will pay you to talk about this amazing thing that you love*!
* Other goals might include global domination, finally winning the heart of your childhood sweetheart when they happen across your witty banter, or securing a lifetime supply of ice cream through your show’s influence…
Sounds pretty good right?
The Problem
If you find yourself identifying with any of the above podcasting dreams, I want you to take that “advice” about creating whatever the hell you want just because you’re interested in it and throw it in the trash. And then burn it. And then get a super heavy weight, attach it to your (100% biodegradable) trash bin and throw it in the ocean.
Here’s the deal: If you have any aspirations of creating change on a broad level, or supporting yourself to any extent through your podcast, that piece of advice is still somewhat relevant, but you’ve got a whole bunch of work to do before you even get to the “just create content” stage, and there are a number of potential caveats along the way.
Let’s look at the advice one more time before breaking down the issues and the hurdles you need to clear first.
“Just create the content you want to create and chances are there are other* people out there interested in it as well!”
* There, no dramatic effect this time. See how boring (read: more accurate) it is??
The (sort of) Myth Of Audience Size
Alright, so let’s start off with that bit about there being (possibly gazillions of) other people interested in the content you’re going to be creating.
I have little doubt that there is probably no topic in existence – no matter how arcane – for which there is a total audience of one. In that sense, our advice is entirely accurate. But before you run off to create a podcast about that only mostly arcane topic with which you are enamoured, consider this:
While most topics have some kind of built-in audience, relatively few have an audience large enough to support you in your grand podcasting (or global domination) aspirations.
So how do you know where to even start when it comes to choosing your topic and creating content that people will love enough to help catapult you to your goals?
We’re going to cover that in a minute, but first, let’s look at the other problematic statement hidden in our ever-so-helpful advice.
Does Your Audience Even Want Your Content?
So maybe you’re already convinced beyond all doubt that there is, in fact, an audience for the content you want to create. Problem solved, right?
Maybe.
There may, in fact, be a positively ginormous audience for your chosen content, but an audience that is already heavily saturated by other podcasts, blogs, youtube content, etc, including established shows that may be covering the exact same content that you were planning on creating.
Does the audience size help you at this point?
Again, maybe.
The way I see it, you’ve got three options in a situation such as this:
- Stick to your guns and simply produce an objectively better show than everything else out there (or most everything).
- Stick to your guns, produce a solid show and out market, promote, and hustle everything else out there (or most everything).
- Abandon your original topic and look for a gap in the existing content that you’re still excited and knowledgeable about and commit to filling that niche.
- Say “Screw it” and head to the nearest ice cream shop…
So while #4 is arguably the most sensible option, we’re at a podcast conference and not an ice cream convention, so at best we’ll pair it with option #3 as being the least amount of work when it comes to growing and establishing a successful show in a crowded niche that has a chance of getting you to your goals.
A Quick Note On Differentiation
Ok, so while the option to pivot into a sub-niche that isn’t as competitive as your initial topic might be the best way to differentiate yourself in a crowded niche, it’s not the only way.
A couple of other options include:
- Approaching a popular topic from an angle that hasn’t been covered extensively yet
- Employing a show format that hasn’t been used extensively yet
The last option is to cover similar content to that which is already being covered, knowing that you and your personality are going to resonate deeply with some people, who will become your tribe.
While I believe in this strategy wholeheartedly, there are a few things you should know before placing all your eggs in this basket.
- You’d better have a relatable, if not downright infectious personality.
- You’d better be prepared to embrace and show off that relatable if not downright infectious personality at every chance you get.
- You’d better be prepared to market and promote yourself heavily at the start to get in front of people and expose them to your relatable if not downright infectious personality in the first place.
Narrowing Down On Your Topic And Audience
As it turns out, the answers to both ensuring that an acceptable audience size exists at all, as well as how to differentiate yourself in a saturated niche are one and the same.
Research.
Shocker right?
You might be thinking right about how obvious an answer research is, and that you’ve already done research and know everything to know about your potential audience, and I mean sure, a lot of it is anecdotal and inferential, but still, that counts as research!!!
Now, I don’t want to discredit any of your existing knowledge, be it anecdotal, inferential, or cold, hard data, but if you want to start a podcast that you know has a solid chance of doing what you hope it does, you’re going to need to commit to some next level research*.
* Actually it’s not that hard, but most people just don’t bother…
Before we don our lab coats and dive into some audience research techniques, one more thing.
While you might rightly deduce that the strategy we’re talking about in this article might be best applied before you even launch your podcast, you can (and probably should) do similar research throughout the life of your already established show. This is especially if you don’t feel you’re getting the traction you feel there is potential for.
1. Surveying The Existing Landscape
You’ll be thrilled to know that the first step – while not definitive – is an easy starting point, which you may have already completed. Huzzah!
In short, is there anyone else (or multiple people) already operating in your niche in the way you envision yourself doing in the future?
If your goal is to sell ads on your show are there already other podcasters in the niche doing so? If you hope to use your podcast as a means to grow authority to sell products or services, are there others doing that? If your goal is to by any means necessary make your podcast your full-time gig, is there anyone else currently doing that?
Keep in mind that while an important first step, either a “yes” or “no” response to any of these questions doesn’t really mean anything definitive.
On the one hand, if there are others already doing what you hope to do, you have not only your proof of concept, but also a potential roadmap to pull from. On the other, perhaps the market for that content is already being filled by the existing shows and there simply isn’t room for one more of the same or similar.
Likewise, for a lack of competition, it’s entirely possible an audience of sustainable size simply doesn’t exist. Or, perhaps the niche has been overlooked by podcasters and this is a fantastic opportunity for you to step in and be the hero!
Regardless, if there are few or no role models to emulate in the podcasting space, I’d do some further research to see if others are building followings around the topic through their blogs, Youtube channels, or other mediums.
These people could be your biggest allies in tapping into that audience yourself through an alternative medium to what’s already in existence. Most people with large platforms know that there’s much more to be gained through community than through competition*. So get over that fear of rejection and get in touch.
* And the ones who don’t are simply jerks…
2. Keyword Research
Ok, so after you’ve done your overview of the landscape, it’s time to dive into some real data.
I’m guessing if you’re like me and most other people, you use Google a lot. But did you know that you can actually get access to Google’s search data and find out how often specific search terms are used?
Well, you can. And knowing what exactly people are or aren’t searching for can be incredibly useful in tailoring both your broad and narrow content.
Now, we’re not going to get into the weeds of how exactly to conduct your keyword research. That would take up this entire program, and there are better sources than me to learn from. Some of the experts I recommend include:
Ok, so once you’ve sorted out how to actually go about your keyword research, you’re going to want to, well, do some keyword research to find out how many people are actively seeking out content on your topic.
It’s hard to be prescriptive with what kind of search volume to look for. But think about the kind of download numbers you’d like to see, and then take into consideration that only a portion of those searching for your topic would likely subscribe or even listen (not that Google searches are everything). So with that said, a topic with a search volume of 20 hits per day probably is best avoided…
We’ll get further into how to make sense of that data at the end of the next section.
3. Facebook Data
Yeah yeah, I know we’ve heard a lot about Facebook and their data recently, and you’re probably sick of hearing about it by now. But let’s put some of that data to work for you and then see how you feel about it.
To kick things off, if you’ve never set up a Facebook Ads account, you’re going to want to do that first. No, you don’t need to run ads, but the ads platform itself gives you some interesting insights into topics that people identify as being interested in.
Inside the Audience Insights tab, you’ll be able to filter Facebook’s users based on location, age, interests, and a whole bunch more to come up with an estimated audience size.
Construct sample audiences based on a number of interests relevant to the topic you’re wanting to create a show around and you’ll begin to form a rough idea of how many people are actually interested in the content you want to create.
Keep in mind that the Facebook audience and Google keyword research provide different insights, so I’d recommend playing around in both to come up with an estimate as to your potential audience size and how viable it might be.
As a reference, on both platforms, I would also do some searches targeting other terms and interests for which there are existing podcasts of the scale you’re aiming for. This will help you establish a baseline to compare your potential audience size against and help you make your ultimate decision.
4. Talking To Real Live Members Of Your Potential Audience
Ok, so this is the one that sounds easy but is actually so scary that few people ever really do it. It might, however, be the most important step of all.
Chances are, you’re already tapped into some kind of community relevant to your topic, but if not, try looking up Facebook groups, SubReddits, Twitter chats, local meetups, conferences, etc to track your people down.
Once you’ve found your potential future audience, talk with them and mention what you’re hoping to create (or are currently creating) and gauge the reactions. In my experience, if you’re onto something big, people are going to recognize that immediately and be excited about it. Sure, maybe not everyone, but enough people to send a clear message to you that this is something worth pursuing, or at least testing further.
Don’t fall into the trap of thinking that people who don’t seem excited about the idea “just don’t get it.” If you’re seeing a lot of blank faces and find yourself working really hard to explain why your topic matters it could mean one of three things:
- You’re talking to the wrong group of people
- You need to work on the presentation of your topic to make it clear, concise and easily grasped by those you share it with
- The idea is a dud and you should either move on or tweak it substantially
Keep in mind that these conversations are not only great for concept validation, but can also be an invaluable resource for episode topic generation as well as an opportunity to build some early fans by making them feel like they’re a part of the creation process. These early fans could be a huge asset when it comes time to launch.
Beginning The Real Work
Ok, so you’ve done your research, you’ve got a topic you already know people are going to eat up. I guess we can reel in that advice who’s ashes we tossed in the ocean and get ready to launch this thang! Build it and they will come, right??
About that…
Sure, by now you know there’s an audience out there eager for your content, but unfortunately simply creating awesome content and hitting publish is nowhere near enough to grow a show that’s going to satisfy your monetary, global domination, or ice cream abundance desires.
To do that you’re going to need to promote the hell out of your show and use that relatable if not downright infectious personality to get in front of as many people and convert them to listeners who adore you.
Sure, you’re going to need to get your work boots on, but this is where the real fun begins.
You in?
If you’re interested in joining a community of podcasters who, just like you, are willing to put in the work necessary to grow their shows, come hang out in the free Cut The Bullshit Podcast Community. We’re an honest, vulnerable, dedicated group of podcasters looking to change the world with our shows. Seriously, we’d love to have you.
Jeremy travels full-time, loves long-distance cycle touring, and will always look back on the day he finally saved up enough money to buy the Millennium Falcon Lego set as one of his proudest achievements. He believes that the way to grow sustainable businesses is by leading with heart, vulnerability, and helping your people be and become their best selves.
- Why Wouldn’t They Just Google It? - March 14, 2021
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- Podcast Promotion & Marketing Are Different (Here’s How to Use Each Effectively) - March 10, 2021
